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Here's the "fuzzy" math for today:
Out of 19 threads on the Galactic Forum’s first page that are either anyone's questions or a newbie's comments, 4 included recruitment pitches. Within those 4 threads there were 5 recruitment pitches and 4 comments that played along with those pitches. None of the posts were solely about recruitment.
I don’t post these numbers to say things are bad or that things are good. I just think we should know what we’re all discussing.
[Message Edited]
        
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and now my biased opinion...
Norms are established by those who come to a consensus. It is often a consensus of unspoken understanding after just a few express their views in public. I have read the exchange between Exar and Abet and I believe they acted in accordance with the consensus. If one objects to the consensus, one had better speak up loud and fast (a process that is still occurring for this issue). As far as following norms, this cannot be done if there is too much uncertainty.
Which brings me to this: I backtracked this thread and found a question of mine related to today’s uproar that was unanswered:
| Are we discouraging counter recruitment posts, for these are the ones that are often off topic and thus irk people, within question threads? |
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Is the answer "address the question and please refrain from adding more than one recruitment comment for your empire within the thread"?
[Message Edited]
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| Sorry Wombie, appears to be a misunderstanding of what we agreed here, see what I put in post #40 above, I would not intentionally undermine my own proposal. |
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Exar - I went back and read that, and it looks like I am the one with the wrong end of the stick, so apologies to you, ABT and Mayito. I had presumed that keeping the standard Forum clear of recruiting meant that literally; that is, no one posts recruiting stuff anywhere but that sticky CariElf put up.
As it's my misunderstanding, I retract - but then, what's the point of the whole exercise? If we have placed a ban on "Jedi Recruitment Thread" but you can post what you like in any other thread, the standard forum will just attract recruiting notes in every OTHER thread. It's a loophole you could drive a truck through, if you see what I mean.
However, I can see I am not in line with the stated consensus, so again I apologise and am happy to see what unfolds.
     
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#55
by Citizen Exar Kuun - 2/8/2004 6:40:26 PM
| As it's my misunderstanding, I retract - but then, what's the point of the whole exercise? |
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Your candour does you credit Wombie  I do see what you mean but we rely on peoples honour to obey the spirit of the agreement - in a reply one short line and that's it for recruitment, it should not appear in further posts. All posts must contain info related to answering the question. It prevents what was happening before with one question posted and fifty jazzy recruitment flyers with no answer. The banter between myself and ABT was borderline I admit but funny for both of us at least, we were remarking on how toned down we were from our normal recruitment pitches. Do you think this is strict enough Wombie? Can you get a truck through that? Is one recruitment line per empire too much?
| Are we discouraging counter recruitment posts, for these are the ones that are often off topic and thus irk people, within question threads? |
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I'm sorry I didn't notice your original post Kit, good question to which I will now give the reply I should of at the time if I had been managing the thread properly, my bad:
| Is the answer "address the question and please refrain from adding more than one recruitment comment for your empire within the thread"? |
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Yup. That was Spellforces and my original attention.
Should I start a new thread or a new post with clear clarifications of what I thought I had got agreement from most of the major empires for?
None necessary, as a forum we are self-regulating, as such from time to time we must raise 'uncomfortable issues', you are to be  for playing your role in our self-regulation.
Also can we let the spam thread in the main forum die now, we have been given this place for empire related discussions let keep it here. Plus I don't think anyone wants a charged thread like that on the main forum, might scare off newcomers.
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Nice discussion guys, pity that Sirian hasn't taken part in it.
 
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BTW Exar, impressed by the way you handled your response in the other thread.
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| Can you get a truck through that? |
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Depends on how good a driver you are!  Seriously, I see what you mean (and no need to go into hiding, Spellforce  ) and I'm cool with it.
| address the question and please refrain from adding more than one recruitment comment for your empire within the thread |
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I think that's probably the phrase we're agreeing upon, which is fine.
| we rely on peoples honour to obey the spirit of the agreement |
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Yep - and the spirit is we dont jam up general forum threads with endless off topic recruitment (ie everyone feeling they have to add a tag to every newbie post). Cheers!
Edit: this was supposed to show before #58 - lucky I got it right!
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An example of the explanation...
| Can you get a truck through that? Is one recruitment line per empire too much? |
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Speaking on behalf of myself, one line per empire is not too much. I’m sure, however, that some individuals could still drive a truck through that.
Now follow this  Link , Exar, to RIDE THE SURVEY TRUCK OF DOOM!!! YEEEEEEHAAAAAAW!!!
(note: No other G.R.O.S.S. recruitment pitches would be posted in this thread, but this is the Empires forum, not the Galactic Forum. No one is safe from the Kitster in this dark dungeon. Mwahahaha!)
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And as a a helpful community demonstration of Thread Safety Rules, I am happy to post ONE single note to let people know that Special Forces is the place to be! 
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| Thanks Jaws. Not the tone of my normal posts, feel a bit annoyed with myself now . |
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Nothing to be annoyed about Exar..
| BTW can you and Wombie post your e-mail addresses? |
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Certainly  Email
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Indeed Email
Exar: dont let this discussion put you off; two months is well beyond 'newbie' status and your organisational skills have done the job well. 'Self' regulation is just that - the discussion we've just had is good evidence of our ability to straighten things out and clarify stuff.
Of course, my own troops are used to the touch of the Iron Paw...I mean, I NEVER have any discipline problems (oh God, I''ve done it now)        
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I wish to apologize again for my actions. I had a small moment of stupidity, and it will never happen again. I have also read all the new rules, and will leave my recruitment to only the empire logo when I try to help someone with their problems. Hope anyone who is still unhappy with me is satisified with my public denouncement.
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Thanks, I feel a little bit better. BTW, I noticed that Sirian has not stepped into this conversation, but he has made note of myself's and Exar's debatable actions in another thread here: Link beginning at #52, if anyone should wish to read who has not done so to get his opinion on the events.
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) and as a newbie myself - only been playing just under two months - I often feel I am overstepping the mark in organising this thread/self-regulation. If anyone feels I do not have the depth/knowledge of the metaverse to do this please say and I will invite someone from another empire to give me a hand until spellforces return - if they're silly enough to accept 
