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Inter-Empire Political Discussion Thread
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| whole government is heading that way. Last week, a court in Louisania |
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Been going that way for some time in the UK! 
Alex
           
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Nope.
I'm glad you found comfort though.
  
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#227
by Citizen Bam_Bam - 4/15/2004 8:45:52 PM
Renegade--glad your faith provides you comfort. Funny, my thinking about death comes somewhat independent of any faith in God.
Death is one of those things I have absolutely no control over. If it is my time (whether because God decides it, or fate, or whatever), there is little say I have in the matter. Life has taught me not to worry about those things over which I have no control. Hard lesson, mind you, but that's where I am today. Having been near death on more than one occasion (one recently), I can affirm that there wasn't much for me to do about it. I did not have control over my body deciding that I was going to go into anaphalactic shock after taking an antibiotic I had successfully taken for five previous 10 day courses. Had I been elsewhere than my home, I may not be writing this today. Had I taken the first dose on the way back to work after filling the prescription (instead of having to wait until after work because the pharmacy's computers were down), I may not be here. Not in my control or power, so I am NOT going fear it.
   
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| I know where I am going, do you? |
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Yup, I know where ... in the furnace and up in smoke.
 
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Bam-Bam and can you say that was not divine intervention in your case? Or you just want to call it luck, chance? I have quite a few of those experiences. Let me tell you one thing that I have not shared with almost anyone, I used to practice espiritismo (Communicating with the dead people) I have seen, I have experienced and I have witnessed, I have seen the body of people been possesed by evil spirits, I have seen their bodies been thrown around like a hand lift them up and cast them as a baseball!!! I have seen!!! what the dark side looks like, so to me at that time that was the good side, the only side, when I came across with a small new testament given to me by a friend things started to change inside me, slowly but steady. Some days two steps back, another day two step forward, but I kept walking the path, it has been a hard one, a difficult one a harh one, but Jesus said that in this world we (His followers) will endure humilliations, mockery, torture, persecution and been ridiculed because of our faith in Him, and that is what has happened here, there wherever you go and say that you are a beliver in Jesus Christ, you see the fact is the world cannot stand Jesus, because He is the truth, if you check deep inside your feelings, no you in particular but all those who reject Him, if you honestly check inside yourself you will find out that you hate Christ, it is in our nature, our sinful nature rebels against Him, but when you trust Him you are born again, a change takes place inside you. I am being honest are you (all)?
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| Just my two cents, for all those who denied the existence of God, what will hapen to you when you'll die? cease to exist, puff, no more, the silence, the darkness? |
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Well, I guess I'll be put in a wooden box, then either incinerated or stuck in a hole in the ground and left to decompose like every other organic substance. Might even end up as a lump of coal in a few million years.
One thing's for sure, I'm not going to be too worried about it by then. 
  
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| And what have you been smoking? |
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Bah!!!!!
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#233
by Veteran vincible - 4/16/2004 6:13:02 PM
Sure. I do what I can--I eat right, I exercise, I don't smoke, I drive carefully, and so on.
Look, given a choice, I, too, would prefer to live in a universe where I was assured of eternal life in heaven. But that's not enough to make me jump ship and take up religion. Given my knowledge and experiences I feel it would be dishonest for me to do this.
I think the athiest worldview does an excellent job of explaining the world as we see it. It does not fail any empirical or logical test I or anyone else has devised. (It may be added that many religious worldviews have failed such tests.) But most importantly, it seems fundamentally dishonest to believe in something simply because I would like it to be true.
So, even though you're right that an atheist thinks he'll just see seventy brief years of life and that's it, and that my gut feelings on the subject are that I would prefer there to be an afterlife--the bottom line is that I don't think with my gut. I think with my head. And my head tells me that no matter how much I'd like there to be a benevolent god to watch over us and bring me to heaven, that's not sufficient reason to believe in one.
  
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#234
by Citizen Exar Kuun - 4/18/2004 2:32:53 PM
Would have replied earlier but have been getting battered on another short weekend break 
| Therefore, the question of his existance is outside the realm of science. You have yet to refute it. In fact, your own statement proves it. You can state the theory of evolution backwards and forwards. Quote DNA, double helixes, induced point mutations, and the like untill you're blue in the face. Still does not refute the above statement |
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Your missing the point, I see nothing in this world that requires a god to exist. What I was trying to say, although I could have put it more eloquently, is that once you look deeper into something you can see how it all works, so simple, so neatly joined, governed by simple laws of interaction - there doesn't need to be anything further.
| Perhaps when you actually achieve an education level you can Lord over someone (Ph. D.) you'll have learned some humility and refrain from doing so. |
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I never intentionally tried to "lord it over" anyone, I was speaking from my point of view as a scientist, I merely said some of what I have achieved so that people didn't think I was basing anything I said on "popular Science". If it came across as "lording it over" to anyone else then I apologise to you. As to a PhD Jack, I did start one but never finished for reasons I'm not going into here, if you wish I will happily send you a private e-mail but there is no way I am posting them on the net. It was on the structure of a protein called NADPH-dependant protochlorophyllide oxidoreductase which controls development of the etioplast in plants, in the three short months I worked on it I managed to detemine how the protein fits into the organellar membrane, its sidedness and come up with a theoretical stucture of the protein as it lies within the membrane - the last of which is something very few people can do. I was considered to be "exceptionally talented" by the university and participated in my first research project by the end of my second year. In short the reason I don't have a PhD Jack is not because I don't have the ability but because I don't want one.
| After all, if they could, why would they attend church with the rest of the unlearned according to Exar? |
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I didn't say one precluded the other, I just said that it does for me basically - see above. As I said in an earlier post - if people find comfort in religion, if it helps them, provdes them with a framework within which to live their lives then good luck to them.
| By the way, they have studies that show the Christian prayer group in general did better than the non prayer group. |
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The only reliable studies I am aware of have attributed this to several factors. Higher standards of living among churchgoers, in the UK at least it tends to be the middle classes who attend church. Also belief does have a positive effect on the brain in some churchgoers and I think there may have been research into the personality types that I will try to dig up if ever I get a spare minute. The brain has a degree of control over immune system can enhances the immune response. There have been no studies I am aware of that have been unable to explain any difference between prayer and non-prayer groups. It is reasonably certain though that it does have a positive effect on certain people.
| Are you afraid of dying? Before I was a Christian I was terrified about death. The question about what will happen to me after I die always scared me, |
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I'm not really afraid of dying. I've lived a life full of people who love me, have tried to do their best for me, have helped me grow and change into the young man I am today - if it ends tommorrow then its been worthwhile. It doesn't matter to me if there is or isn't anything after today. Tommorrow is a bonus in which I can find out or do something new.
| know in whom I have believed and I have the hope and the blessed assurance that when I die I know where I am going and that is priceless, because I don't fear death. I know where I am going, do you? |
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In case you didn't guess I believe that once my body dies, thats it, all thats left is food for some other organism and the memories people have of me.
[Message Edited]
 
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| #235 by Citizen Exar Kuun - 4/18/2004 2:34:23 PM And what have you been smoking? |
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Psa 92:6 A brutish man knoweth not; neither doth a fool understand this.
Psa 53:1 [[To the chief Musician upon Mahalath, Maschil, [A Psalm] of David.]] The fool hath said in his heart, [There is] no God.
Pro 10:8 The wise in heart will receive commandments: but a prating fool shall fall.
Pro 12:15 The way of a fool [is] right in his own eyes: but he that hearkeneth unto counsel [is] wise.
Pro 14:16 A wise [man] feareth, and departeth from evil: but the fool rageth, and is confident.
Pro 17:10 A reproof entereth more into a wise man than an hundred stripes into a fool.
Pro 17:24 Wisdom [is] before him that hath understanding; but the eyes of a fool [are] in the ends of the earth.
Pro 19:1 Better [is] the poor that walketh in his integrity, than [he that is] perverse in his lips, and is a fool.
Pro 23:9 Speak not in the ears of a fool: for he will despise the wisdom of thy words.
Pro 26:11 As a dog returneth to his vomit, [so] a fool returneth to his folly.
My last words to you
Mat 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine
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I'm quite sure students of the Koran could come up with an equal amount of similar quotes referring to their God, as could those of all the other varied religions in the World, no doubt.
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Those quotes are not about God, but about the attitude of the fool people that don't want to take the warnings as a serious threat. To everyone its own. You all have been taught, but you don't want to listen. Your blood is no longer in my hands, but in yours.
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Well I was not using Bible quotes but you and KEmperor were so disrespectful by accusing me of being smoking weed, that I opted for quotes from the Bible, maybe you would show a little bit of respect.
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I didn't see any happy faces beside his post intended to be as a joke.
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Anyways, you can choose to believe whatever you want, one day the time shall come and we will see who was right and who was not.
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So... let me get this straight.
According to a Christian, if I choose to ignore the teachings of The Bible - I'm damned.
According to a Muslim, if I choose to ignore the teachings of The Koran - I'm damned.
According to any number of other religions, if I choose to ignore the teachings of their respective holy books - I'm damned.
I think I'm quite happy right where I am, and damned!
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Direct message from God (the true and only one)
The fool hath said in his heart, [There is] no God.
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